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Post by federov91 on Feb 20, 2017 14:03:56 GMT
I have to say, maybe against popular opinion, I am a fan of TD, I do find him more vocal than he is characterised and I think it is a positive that he is protective of his players in interviews and while his post-match answers can be formulaic and not interesting the questions asked are so similar and on the surface, it’s hard for him not to be.
Do we have a bad team this year, no not in my opinion. Are we inconsistent, yes to a frustrating degree. Break down the table we have the best home record in the Elite League against Erdhart teams 14 points out of 18 (1.55 points per game), credit should be given for this, but at the same time we have the worst home record in the Elite League against Gardiner teams (1.07 points per game). Does this highlight anything other than our lack of consistency? I am not sure, IMO we play better against the better teams as a result of playing slightly deeper and tighter positionally on the ice, which protects our D and their lack of mobility hurts us when we play a high attacking game or run and gun but I could be way off. Would I make whole sale changes to the 16/17 team we have at the moment, no, I feel we only need tweaks. I’m not claiming to know what systems we use in detail but I do know we have a preference/tendency to recruit fast, technical, puck carrying style players, and why not, we must use the size of the ice pad to our advantage. For me the players that currently do this job with intensity should be kept for next year - Schaber, Fox, Dingle, Brooks and Stockton fill the FIA style for a top 6, as a club we’ve generally been successful with a top line with those attributes but I think the key to success is adding more variety with our depth players, we don’t really have that with our forwards at the moment, which probably explains to a degree our Plan A wins or losses. If the above 5 return, that leaves 3 slots for import forwards, adding a mix of Power Forwards in Pitton / Siddall moulds and Two Way Forwards/Grinder forwards in the Danny moulds would certainly help give us that mix, get that toughness to dig the puck out of the corners, difficulty to knock off the puck and to push away from the front of the goal, that we need for away games and use our extra import forward numbers to allow special team players like Danny who put great work in killing penalties, blocking shots, and playing smart defensive forward play, with the increase in numbers, I think it is possible now to have these role style players and would certainly help our balance and mix.
Defence again has a good core but we seem to be struggling with mobility and parterships for me there is slightly the wrong balance between offensive and shutdown defencemen, the influence of a Matt Delahey seems to be missing this year, calming and mobile would make a difference at the back and bring balance to players such as Moyer, Haines, Paquet, who are better D-men than our stats suggest and I think the right chemistry will definitely help with that. Brits I am a fan of Wands and Muir they definitely have their roles and Gunny has potential, I’d love to see a crowdfunded offer of fans paying for a Brit upgrade put to the directors over the summer.
So I would keep the coaching set-up in charge and hope tweaks come in and hope club knuckles down and focuses on the true problem how the Ice Hockey Club is run commercially, where we are 100% 10th in this league, fix the volunteering structure, commercial management, fan engagement, match night experience and social media presence but I’ll try to cover my views on that on the Time for Change thread.
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Post by coloradoflyer on Feb 20, 2017 14:23:54 GMT
best way for team in this league
power forward - dingle - sniper
power forward - centre - brooks
schaber - centre - fast drive the net winger
couple of big lads at the back with moyer, paquet and I would bring in 2 or 3 full time brits
or something similar to that
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Post by daviejojo on Feb 20, 2017 14:42:36 GMT
best way for team in this league power forward - dingle - sniper power forward - centre - brooks schaber - centre - fast drive the net winger couple of big lads at the back with moyer, paquet and I would bring in 2 or 3 full time brits or something similar to that Or just go with my theory, 15 enforcers :-) It's not about winning, it's about clumping :-) :-) :-)
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ronniemac
Pro
Posts: 1,520
NHL Team: Chicago Blackhawks
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Post by ronniemac on Feb 20, 2017 14:44:10 GMT
federov 91
I think you must have missed several interviews where Todd has hung players out to dry, content to blame everything and everyone except himself for 6 years of mediocrity. We have seen the same scenario over those 6 seasons, it must rank along side a movie buff that has watched SLAPSHOT till the colour wore off the film ....... I have actually referred to The Flyers as our very own version of the afore said film such are the similarities. There are rumours flying around that Flyers will exit the EIHL which may have some substance as we all know in which direction the owner would prefer to tread, my opinion differs as without doubt that is not the way a club with the tradition it commands should venture.
What really needs to happen is...... take the pressure off the owner and appoint a General Manager that has full control of the club, make that person totally responsible for the success and future whilst ensuring that The Coach is fully aware the GM will be pushing him very strongly for results regularly to take the team to the sharp end of the league and keeping them there, that must be the ambition for Fife Flyers. We must also totally re-vamp the match night experience, it is a complete shambles at the moment and has been for a long while, there is so much dead wood within the club structure that needs discarded to move the club forward because people are voting with their feet and marching in the wrong direction.
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Post by daviejojo on Feb 20, 2017 14:47:55 GMT
federov 91 I think you must have missed several interviews where Todd has hung players out to dry, content to blame everything and everyone except himself for 6 years of mediocrity. We have seen the same scenario over those 6 seasons, it must rank along side a movie buff that has watched SLAPSHOT till the colour wore off the film ....... I have actually referred to The Flyers as our very own version of the afore said film such are the similarities. There are rumours flying around that Flyers will exit the EIHL which may have some substance as we all know in which direction the owner would prefer to tread, my opinion differs as without doubt that is not the way a club with the tradition it commands should venture. What really needs to happen is...... take the pressure off the owner and appoint a General Manager that has full control of the club, make that person totally responsible for the success and future whilst ensuring that The Coach is fully aware the GM will be pushing him very strongly for results regularly to take the team to the sharp end of the league and keeping them there, that must be the ambition for Fife Flyers. We must also totally re-vamp the match night experience, it is a complete shambles at the moment and has been for a long while, there is so much dead wood within the club structure that needs discarded to move the club forward because people are voting with their feet and marching in the wrong direction. Can't really argue with that. Dropping to a Tier 2 league would be a disaster for the club, but my fear, crowds probably wouldn't drop that much, maybe down to 1500 say, so the money drop would be more than covered my a vast reduction in imports, hence a healthy bottom line is retained. I pray these rumours are unfounded, would be nice if the club could commit one way or another, as they do seem to be gaining momentum. I really fear this is the reason for inaction this year, just accepting it because in reality, it doesn't matter, it's lower league hockey coming soon at FIA
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Post by Dirty Lyle on Feb 20, 2017 14:53:53 GMT
I have to say, maybe against popular opinion, I am a fan of TD, I do find him more vocal than he is characterised and I think it is a positive that he is protective of his players in interviews and while his post-match answers can be formulaic and not interesting the questions asked are so similar and on the surface, it’s hard for him not to be. Do we have a bad team this year, no not in my opinion. Are we inconsistent, yes to a frustrating degree. Break down the table we have the best home record in the Elite League against Erdhart teams 14 points out of 18 (1.55 points per game), credit should be given for this, but at the same time we have the worst home record in the Elite League against Gardiner teams (1.07 points per game). Does this highlight anything other than our lack of consistency? I am not sure, IMO we play better against the better teams as a result of playing slightly deeper and tighter positionally on the ice, which protects our D and their lack of mobility hurts us when we play a high attacking game or run and gun but I could be way off. Would I make whole sale changes to the 16/17 team we have at the moment, no, I feel we only need tweaks. I’m not claiming to know what systems we use in detail but I do know we have a preference/tendency to recruit fast, technical, puck carrying style players, and why not, we must use the size of the ice pad to our advantage. For me the players that currently do this job with intensity should be kept for next year - Schaber, Fox, Dingle, Brooks and Stockton fill the FIA style for a top 6, as a club we’ve generally been successful with a top line with those attributes but I think the key to success is adding more variety with our depth players, we don’t really have that with our forwards at the moment, which probably explains to a degree our Plan A wins or losses. If the above 5 return, that leaves 3 slots for import forwards, adding a mix of Power Forwards in Pitton / Siddall moulds and Two Way Forwards/Grinder forwards in the Danny moulds would certainly help give us that mix, get that toughness to dig the puck out of the corners, difficulty to knock off the puck and to push away from the front of the goal, that we need for away games and use our extra import forward numbers to allow special team players like Danny who put great work in killing penalties, blocking shots, and playing smart defensive forward play, with the increase in numbers, I think it is possible now to have these role style players and would certainly help our balance and mix. Defence again has a good core but we seem to be struggling with mobility and parterships for me there is slightly the wrong balance between offensive and shutdown defencemen, the influence of a Matt Delahey seems to be missing this year, calming and mobile would make a difference at the back and bring balance to players such as Moyer, Haines, Paquet, who are better D-men than our stats suggest and I think the right chemistry will definitely help with that. Brits I am a fan of Wands and Muir they definitely have their roles and Gunny has potential, I’d love to see a crowdfunded offer of fans paying for a Brit upgrade put to the directors over the summer. So I would keep the coaching set-up in charge and hope tweaks come in and hope club knuckles down and focuses on the true problem how the Ice Hockey Club is run commercially, where we are 100% 10th in this league, fix the volunteering structure, commercial management, fan engagement, match night experience and social media presence but I’ll try to cover my views on that on the Time for Change thread. How can you say we are 10th commercially..We have probably the most successful sponsorship that this club has ever had and way ahead of some other clubs. The new commercial manager has worked wonders with little back up. The rest of your post is well thought out, totally disagree with most of it, and am bored as hell watching this team that Todd has put together. We really need change as the declining crowds are proving.
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Post by waterboy on Feb 20, 2017 15:09:49 GMT
I have to say, maybe against popular opinion, I am a fan of TD, I do find him more vocal than he is characterised and I think it is a positive that he is protective of his players in interviews and while his post-match answers can be formulaic and not interesting the questions asked are so similar and on the surface, it’s hard for him not to be. Do we have a bad team this year, no not in my opinion. Are we inconsistent, yes to a frustrating degree. Break down the table we have the best home record in the Elite League against Erdhart teams 14 points out of 18 (1.55 points per game), credit should be given for this, but at the same time we have the worst home record in the Elite League against Gardiner teams (1.07 points per game). Does this highlight anything other than our lack of consistency? I am not sure, IMO we play better against the better teams as a result of playing slightly deeper and tighter positionally on the ice, which protects our D and their lack of mobility hurts us when we play a high attacking game or run and gun but I could be way off. Would I make whole sale changes to the 16/17 team we have at the moment, no, I feel we only need tweaks. I’m not claiming to know what systems we use in detail but I do know we have a preference/tendency to recruit fast, technical, puck carrying style players, and why not, we must use the size of the ice pad to our advantage. For me the players that currently do this job with intensity should be kept for next year - Schaber, Fox, Dingle, Brooks and Stockton fill the FIA style for a top 6, as a club we’ve generally been successful with a top line with those attributes but I think the key to success is adding more variety with our depth players, we don’t really have that with our forwards at the moment, which probably explains to a degree our Plan A wins or losses. If the above 5 return, that leaves 3 slots for import forwards, adding a mix of Power Forwards in Pitton / Siddall moulds and Two Way Forwards/Grinder forwards in the Danny moulds would certainly help give us that mix, get that toughness to dig the puck out of the corners, difficulty to knock off the puck and to push away from the front of the goal, that we need for away games and use our extra import forward numbers to allow special team players like Danny who put great work in killing penalties, blocking shots, and playing smart defensive forward play, with the increase in numbers, I think it is possible now to have these role style players and would certainly help our balance and mix. Defence again has a good core but we seem to be struggling with mobility and parterships for me there is slightly the wrong balance between offensive and shutdown defencemen, the influence of a Matt Delahey seems to be missing this year, calming and mobile would make a difference at the back and bring balance to players such as Moyer, Haines, Paquet, who are better D-men than our stats suggest and I think the right chemistry will definitely help with that. Brits I am a fan of Wands and Muir they definitely have their roles and Gunny has potential, I’d love to see a crowdfunded offer of fans paying for a Brit upgrade put to the directors over the summer. So I would keep the coaching set-up in charge and hope tweaks come in and hope club knuckles down and focuses on the true problem how the Ice Hockey Club is run commercially, where we are 100% 10th in this league, fix the volunteering structure, commercial management, fan engagement, match night experience and social media presence but I’ll try to cover my views on that on the Time for Change thread. How can you say we are 10th commercially..We have probably the most successful sponsorship that this club has ever had and way ahead of some other clubs. The new commercial manager has worked wonders with little back up. The rest of your post is well thought out, totally disagree with most of it, and am bored as hell watching this team that Todd has put together. We really need change as the declining crowds are proving. Pity some of our main sponsors are walking away after this season.
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Post by federov91 on Feb 20, 2017 15:20:42 GMT
Ronnie, I know the players as a collective may get it but names aren’t usually used, which is I feel is the right thing. I couldn’t agree more on the improvements in Operations/Management Structure, as I said I believe we are 10th in the league for this and the reason for that is a real disconnect with the fans and management, even DJ that exists and that is hurting the bottom line, you only have to read on here to see it. On the positive side I think from a players perspective, Fife Flyers players are well looked after and may have best job security in the league through form or injury, we pay well and have developed a good ex-import network for recruiting. Sponsorship does look like it’s on the up Dirty Lyle but I do think more can be done in that regard to bring us in line with that tier just below the arena teams, where we should be and I agree with Waterboy with the disconnect there and no sign of changing would they look again/ walk away.
However, they are only a part of running a club and the operations aspect is lacking compared to our peers, is it really resource based when you see the job Manchester are doing, are we comparing with them. Fife Flyers are a unique team in this league and we must tap into this aspect. You only have to think out of our conference, every other team wants to beat Fife Flyers the most for our history and our rink which does offer the potential to be a genuine competitive advantage if the match night entertainment is correctly used, fix the entertainment could really be revamped, it’s not hard to look at our peers and come up with ideas.
On a day to day level, I would love to see more details of corporate information, sponsorship opportunities online but mainly increased fan engagement to get everyone engaged, we have this great history, use it! Re-runs of old games somewhere or online mid-week or pre-game, I’m sure people would watch, Doug Smail’s 9 points versus Cardiff or Fife coming back from 4-0 down against Peterbrough Pirates, even last week’s game, heck get ex- local players to talk about this, we can do so much more, how easy is it to post a on this day post to get people engaged. We should be aiming for an unrivalled engaged community club, we are the right size/market to do this but I do feel this is beyond us unless we can move past our closed structure of tight control with management and volunteers. We all want the club to succeed, so open the doors and let people help, we’ve all read on here from many people that are happy and qualified to help improve this club by volunteering in areas such as social media, highlights or commercially but are turned away. For example our highlights are not concise or have generally have replays like other in the league, despite a good webcast this can’t be too hard, let’s get the local colleges involved. Our PR, website and social media is not working currently, I think one guy does this, it’s not his fault but social media has evolved so much, this is a growing role and needs share to provide regular informed communication across all platforms which is demanded from fans today and not too hard to achieve.
Get help with sponsorship, corporate engagement, fan engagement and alignment between the fans and board, commercial is my field and I’d happily help, you see how the fans pay for players and other things at some clubs, with the loyalty to this club it could absolutely be done here, I mentioned paying for a FT Brit. it could be done, why not. All this would definitely help the bottom line and make us a better club. Is the culture of the club down to tight control driven from the owners or from the volunteers who don’t want to share their place, who knows but with extra hands you would see the benefits, look again at Manchester and the strides they are making you hope we can do the same and stop hearing the phrase “there is so much potential in Fife but it’s never used”. Bit of a long winded rant but the potential is there for all to see.
I guess the main point I'm trying to make with this and my earlier post is the team on the ice needs tweaked not overhauled but the structure and management and face of the club could be so much better and a GM would be a great idea as Ronnie says.
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Post by Dirty Lyle on Feb 20, 2017 15:35:53 GMT
How can you say we are 10th commercially..We have probably the most successful sponsorship that this club has ever had and way ahead of some other clubs. The new commercial manager has worked wonders with little back up. The rest of your post is well thought out, totally disagree with most of it, and am bored as hell watching this team that Todd has put together. We really need change as the declining crowds are proving. Pity some of our main sponsors are walking away after this season. Yip I know one has said he will not, but not heard of any others. There is a danger we could lose more if the directors don't give fans what they crave. They have to remember that a lot of the sponsors are hockey fans as well as sponsors. We appear to have done well this year on sponsorship, the directors should be looking to build on that, not driving them away.
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Post by waterboy on Feb 20, 2017 16:22:17 GMT
Ronnie, I know the players as a collective may get it but names aren’t usually used, which is I feel is the right thing. I couldn’t agree more on the improvements in Operations/Management Structure, as I said I believe we are 10th in the league for this and the reason for that is a real disconnect with the fans and management, even DJ that exists and that is hurting the bottom line, you only have to read on here to see it. On the positive side I think from a players perspective, Fife Flyers players are well looked after and may have best job security in the league through form or injury, we pay well and have developed a good ex-import network for recruiting. Sponsorship does look like it’s on the up Dirty Lyle but I do think more can be done in that regard to bring us in line with that tier just below the arena teams, where we should be and I agree with Waterboy with the disconnect there and no sign of changing would they look again/ walk away. However, they are only a part of running a club and the operations aspect is lacking compared to our peers, is it really resource based when you see the job Manchester are doing, are we comparing with them. Fife Flyers are a unique team in this league and we must tap into this aspect. You only have to think out of our conference, every other team wants to beat Fife Flyers the most for our history and our rink which does offer the potential to be a genuine competitive advantage if the match night entertainment is correctly used, fix the entertainment could really be revamped, it’s not hard to look at our peers and come up with ideas. On a day to day level, I would love to see more details of corporate information, sponsorship opportunities online but mainly increased fan engagement to get everyone engaged, we have this great history, use it! Re-runs of old games somewhere or online mid-week or pre-game, I’m sure people would watch, Doug Smail’s 9 points versus Cardiff or Fife coming back from 4-0 down against Peterbrough Pirates, even last week’s game, heck get ex- local players to talk about this, we can do so much more, how easy is it to post a on this day post to get people engaged. We should be aiming for an unrivalled engaged community club, we are the right size/market to do this but I do feel this is beyond us unless we can move past our closed structure of tight control with management and volunteers. We all want the club to succeed, so open the doors and let people help, we’ve all read on here from many people that are happy and qualified to help improve this club by volunteering in areas such as social media, highlights or commercially but are turned away. For example our highlights are not concise or have generally have replays like other in the league, despite a good webcast this can’t be too hard, let’s get the local colleges involved. Our PR, website and social media is not working currently, I think one guy does this, it’s not his fault but social media has evolved so much, this is a growing role and needs share to provide regular informed communication across all platforms which is demanded from fans today and not too hard to achieve. Get help with sponsorship, corporate engagement, fan engagement and alignment between the fans and board, commercial is my field and I’d happily help, you see how the fans pay for players and other things at some clubs, with the loyalty to this club it could absolutely be done here, I mentioned paying for a FT Brit. it could be done, why not. All this would definitely help the bottom line and make us a better club. Is the culture of the club down to tight control driven from the owners or from the volunteers who don’t want to share their place, who knows but with extra hands you would see the benefits, look again at Manchester and the strides they are making you hope we can do the same and stop hearing the phrase “there is so much potential in Fife but it’s never used”. Bit of a long winded rant but the potential is there for all to see. I guess the main point I'm trying to make with this and my earlier post is the team on the ice needs tweaked not overhauled but the structure and management and face of the club could be so much better and a GM would be a great idea as Ronnie says. You know what most of this is probably right I would debate a few things but and there is a kicker - The owners Muir in particular do not want to change. They believe fans will come along regardless of what they do or don't do. Full houses who cares they bring in enough anyway. Fulltime Brits pah those boys should be thankful they get to play for the Flyers. Don't like it get another club, see Craig Moore John Dolan Ben Davies etc etc. Pay for a GM are you mad I have been doing this my way for years and it works fine (looks for around for the bucket full of sand with the head shaped hole in it). They are stuck in the past with the same "local club for local players" rhetoric. Speaking with former players its been like this for decades and wont ever change. We actually make legends of the club pay to watch games. Full price like any other punter. Dutes as Coach is nothing but the cheap and easy option and his ego means he plays along to Tam's tune. There are better coaches out there but that costs time money and some effort. Cynical and negative I know but its an opinion based on years of watching this club shoot itself in the foot time and time again. What do they do to push ticket sales apart from send out a tweet during a gubbing from the Clan for the game the following night. Yes they need to promote the game but there appears to be no strategy at all from a marketing POV, its just a scatter gun approach on twitter. This club can and should be punching far higher than they are hell even Dave Simms said it years back when Sky came to do a game. They seriously need to cut out the deadwood from the organisation and restructure the whole club. Only way that happens is if the current owners get bought out.
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Post by federov91 on Feb 20, 2017 16:45:58 GMT
Agree with a lot of what you’re saying Waterboy, particularly sad to hear that about the ex-players paying full amount to watch, so much potential in the club it’s easy to understand everyone’s frustration, just have to hope someone is listening or a positive change/additions will come.
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Post by waterboy on Feb 20, 2017 17:44:26 GMT
I looked back for that Dave simms bit.
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Post by waterboy on Feb 20, 2017 17:46:19 GMT
That's from 4 years ago.
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Post by daviejojo on Feb 20, 2017 18:04:52 GMT
Is spot on though
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Post by coloradoflyer on Feb 20, 2017 18:08:03 GMT
Agree with a lot of what you’re saying Waterboy, particularly sad to hear that about the ex-players paying full amount to watch, so much potential in the club it’s easy to understand everyone’s frustration, just have to hope someone is listening or a positive change/additions will come. didn't you see chic Cottrell's post on FB club should be ashamed of it's self
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